Moodle Association of Japan Discussion Forum

Additional name fields

Additional name fields

by David CAMPBELL -
Number of replies: 15

We have started using the additional name fields to have kanji, hiragana and romaji and we put the student number in the "optional student id field" for every student. It seems to be going okay, but the way names are presented for different activities and in different parts of Moodle doesn't seem consistent. Sometimes you will see the kanji and hiragana and at other times all three sets of names and the id number. 

This is how I have the "full name format" lastname firstname (lastnamephonetic firstnamephonetic) (alternatename)

and for "Show user identy" I only have ID number selected.

On the "Language Settings" page I have the "Default Language" set to Japanese.

How are other people using this feature? Is it working the way you had envisioned it? Is there any tweaking that we need to ask Moodle HQ to do?

In reply to David CAMPBELL

Re: Additional name fields

by Don HINKELMAN -

I believe Tom Robb and Adrian Greeve started some Tracker issues to make the way additional names appear on pages more useable and flexible.  Tom, could you tell us those Tracker items and how we can help promote their development (i.e. vote on them, comment on them?). David, could you put some screenshots up indicating how it shows now, and how you wish it would show?

In reply to Don HINKELMAN

Re: Additional name fields

by David CAMPBELL -

Here are a few screenshots.

This is from the feedback page for an online text assignment.

enrolled user list

This is from the course enrolled user list.

quick grading

This is a for the quick grading of an offline assignment.Student profile

Student profile page.

I still need to see how other modules work with the names, but the enrolled user list and the name feedback  page don't have all the information. 

In reply to Don HINKELMAN

Re: Additional name fields

by Thomas ROBB -

Sorry to be slow to respond concerning the additional name fields situation.Actually, there is still much work to be done. The database functionality is there, but there are still many report/display screens that don't take advantage of it.

We asked Version2 to give us a quite for how to improve one of the screens and they came back with a reasonable quote, in the neighborhood of ¥150,000.  If I had been in Okinawa, I would have suggested that we push forward with that development, taking the cost from what we intended to donate to Moodle HQ, but that didn't happen.

I still think that we need to ask Version2 to work on the implementation, and once that is done, then tackle some of the remaining weaknesses.

In reply to Thomas ROBB

Re: Additional name fields

by David CAMPBELL -

Tom,

Thanks for the update. As I am getting into the semester and doing more with my courses I am finding some odd presentations of names and the lack of things in certain areas.

One thing I would like to  see would be for an instructor to be able to set how they would like to see the names displayed. There will be situations where a non-Japanese speaking instructor is only going to want to see romaji while a Japanese speaking instructor may only wish to see kanji or kanji and hiragana. Do you think that would be feasible? 

In reply to David CAMPBELL

Re: Additional name fields

by Thomas ROBB -

David,

Which particular displays would you prioritize?  For example, the Participant listing, or the Grade book?

 

--Tom

In reply to Thomas ROBB

Re: Additional name fields

by Don HINKELMAN -

I think Tom's question is exactly right.  It will help us focus on a particular need and we can design how that screen should look.  Once those specs are made then we take one of two paths:

  1. hire Version2 to make it for 150,000 yen (from the 2015 budget?)
  2. make a Tracker item and push it (there is a lot of openness at HQ to help here) for the December 2.8 release
In reply to Don HINKELMAN

Re: Additional name fields

by Thomas ROBB -

Adrian led me to believe that the best route would be to just do it locally and present the final product for integration into the base code.

Dealing with the tracker, when there are so many competing issues would simply delay things.

David brings up one point that I hadn't considered.  Right now, the name display is only configurable at the site level.  In cases where there are some instructors who prefer NOT to read the local language, they would require a separate set of settings.  Perhaps these could be at the course level, OR perhaps the site manager could select one suite of settings for those who select Japanese (for example) as there display language and another for those who select English.

In reply to Thomas ROBB

Re: Additional name fields

by Don HINKELMAN -

>> Adrian led me to believe that the best route would be to just do it locally and present the final product for integration into the base code.

Ah. I see. Now I really wish you had been at the Moot.  smile  We could have easily reserved some funds at the right time.  Since the 2014 budget is now set, I suspect there is no room for additional expenses.  Tetsuo and Hideto, is that correct?

I never asked Adrian directly about the next steps in the ANF project but I know he did set up a few Tracker items for it.  Also, Adrian made about 12 (yes, twelve!) new Tracker items for the Database Module, a direct result of the workshop led by David and others.  So that is what I mean by "openness". 

Anyway, I think David, you should contact Adrian directly and ask him which forum would be good for discussing this issue.  I think we should discuss it on Moodle.org as well, because if we get into programming strategies (i.e. should it be a course setting or site settings for each screen) it goes beyond our particular MAJ needs.  I would be happy to contact Adrian but I just asked him to write an article for our Proceedings so he may not want to respond to me. wink

In reply to Thomas ROBB

Re: Additional name fields

by David CAMPBELL -

Tom,

I am not sure if I would prioritize one particular area, but say have a course setting  where the instructor could select to use the alternate name or the standard surname, given name settings or all of three. 

What I have experienced so far is that having all the names displayed in certain windows can make for a cluttered and difficult user experience. This is real problem on a mobile device.

 

In reply to David CAMPBELL

Re: Additional name fields

by David CAMPBELL -

I have discovered another issue with the alternate name field. It is not used in any of the searches. For example in searching groups or enrolled users it will only search on the username or first name and surname.

Would be possible to have a course setting that allows the instructor to select which fields to use for search or create filters in more of the areas where there is search available?

 

In reply to David CAMPBELL

Re: Additional name fields

by Adrian GREEVE -

Hello,

I thought that I would post the appropriate issues that have been created to deal with the additional name fields.  

  • MDL-46003 Is to make sure that all areas that are displaying names go through the fullname function (which shows additional name fields).
  • MDL-40616 There are inconsistencies with how names are being displayed around Moodle. I believe that this issue is the most important issue to get fixed first. I believe that the current areas that have been mentioned above are directly related to this issue, and once this is fixed, user names should be displayed as expected.
  • MDL-40356 This is also quite important. An additional setting would greatly improve the flexibility of the additional name fields. Currently users with the permission to view the full names of users can only see the first name and surname. Places like the enrolment page (which can only be viewed by people who have this capability) will only show these two name fields. This issue is very closely related to MDL-40616 (the issue directly above).

I acknowledge that this is an ongoing project and that it might not be possible to completely satisfying everyone, but I think that if we can get these issues completed, that we will be much closer to having a solution that will meet most peoples needs.

Please feel free to send me emails about this topic at any time: adrian@moodle.com

In reply to Adrian GREEVE

Re: Additional name fields

by Don HINKELMAN -

Thanks, Adrian, for posting this summary of Tracker Issues related to Additional Name Fields. I just voted for all three and I hope MAJ officers and members will take just one minute to click on the links to make their vote.  By voting, it helps justify Adrian taking time to keep this project moving along (there are so many competing projects, it would be easy for Additional Fields to get lost among the hundreds of important changes in process). 

In reply to Adrian GREEVE

Re: Additional name fields

by Thomas ROBB -

Thank you, Adrian for your continued dedication to this project! 

There is only one more week of classes and then I'll have some time to devote to ferreting out the places in the code that need modification -- using the helpful hints that you provided earlier.  We will then ask Version to for an estimate for how much money & time it might take to prepare the new code.

In reply to David CAMPBELL

Re: Additional name fields

by Adrian GREEVE -

Just an update on how additional name fields are progressing.

MDL-40356 : An additional setting for additional name fields for teachers, managers and administrators

and

MDL-46921 : Sorting on additional name fields

have been included in the 2.8 release.

In reply to Adrian GREEVE

Re: Additional name fields

by David CAMPBELL -

Adrian,

That's great news. Thank you for the update. I am looking forward to giving it a look soon.